Get Fixel →

How To Create An Online Course

coaches course creation market research strategy tools training replay

(Tip: Slow down video speed above with the gear icon ⚙️)



Hi everybody. It's Jen Kilbourne Obermeier at Pro Organizer Studio.

Hope you're doing well!

If I haven't seen you in a while, because I haven't been live on our public business page in a while.

Nice to see you and thank you for joining me.

Also if you're watching on the replay, thank you for joining me on the replay.

I hope that you guys will get comfortable and also feel comfortable asking me questions as we go.

I'm going to, I have an outline that I'm going to start with, but you'll know how, I like to go on tangents.

I really to answer your question.

If you think of something you want to throw at me, I'll make sure that I see that in the comment.

Let me give you guys a little bit of background.

First of all, if you're watching this now, or if you're catching this on the replay and you are not as familiar with who I am or what I'm talking about.


So I'm the creator of Pro Organizer Studio.

I run an online course called Inspired Organizer which I created on a whim.

Almost I started working on it almost two years ago.

It was July 2016 ago that I started outlining and planning content that I just really felt was on my heart that I wanted to share about organizing businesses.

However, I never planned for it to become my full-time job.

<laugh> little did I know I was diving deep into the world of online business and everything that entails.

If you're wondering why I feel smart enough or qualified enough to talk about online business is because it's been my life for the last two years with Pro Organizer Studio.

I have also had the pleasure and the opportunity to coach some of my students on some virtual organizing, which is basically an online type of organizing coaching service on how to market that, how to sell more of that.


And some other people who have been creating more of a group program type of online product, more like.

I have been able to coach them one-on-one on how exactly do you create that and how do you sell it? Because I understand a lot of what goes into behind the scenes of building an audience online and then how to sell something to them.

This is a topic that is really a little bit it came up in our private group for Inspired Organizer because I know a lot of people that has been one of their goals for 2018 is I want to create some type of online product or group program or do more virtual organizing, but I don't know how to go about that.

Or they haven't really made progress on that goal.


And then some other people had questions about running Facebook groups.

I felt maybe it is time that I just go ahead and put everything that I know, and that I feel about this topic all into one chat.

I did want to bring this back onto the public page because it's not exactly it's not Inspired Organizer-related material that is my course material, which is really primarily focused on selling in-home services, which is obviously in person, I do touch on in the course a little bit about how to create and sell a DIY plan, which is you creating a plan for your client and that being, that's your service, you're creating the plan for your client to carry out on their own without you being there.

I still I would still say that's an in-person service because you still go and you do the consult and everything.


Of course, you could do that virtually, but I still consider that a in-person service.

Then, but we do touch on virtual organizing a little bit in the course, a couple of different ways to go about it.

But I don't go too heavy into how to market it.

Today we'll talk about that.

We'll also talk about other types of online products.

In fact, that's going to be the main part of my outline.

I did make one types of online products starting with free all the way down to the most expensive, which would be one-on-one FaceTime with you over the computer.

Let's talk a little bit first about why any of this is beneficial or why you need to know this.

It is not required for you to do in your organizing business at all.

But I do think that there comes a time for everyone when they want to have at least one component of their business that does not require them to be physically present.


Maybe because you want to take a physical break or because you want to be able to reach a much larger audience than just where you live.

that obviously is a huge reason why this is more of a long-term goal for people, but the hard part is finding the time to set aside to get it going and get it rolling.

When you don't even know who is going to buy a mini course from me, who's going to buy an ebook from me.

We're going to talk about all these things and I'm going to give you some ideas that are based on not just my personal experience, but also things that I have seen other organizers do not necessarily my students, but I have researched and seen a lot in the organizing world.


So I know that there are a lot of things that are being done out there as far as people doing home organizing courses from start to finish, I have seen photo organizing courses.

I have seen meal planning courses, all things that come from a professional organizer's point of view.

But that usually are related to a certain topic.

I'm not going to give you specifics on who or what I'm talking about, because there is a lot out there.

But for example, if you go and search on there is an online learning platform called Udemy.

I don't know how you pronounce it.

U D E M Y.

You can go on there and you can see, for example, if you search for organizing or decluttering for example, I know of a course on there that is all about just decluttering and organizing paperwork and it's not very expensive, but I think you can see how many students have taken it.


I don't know.

Of course Udemy.

They take a percentage of that.

I mean let's not think about the financials just yet.

We'll talk a little bit about pricing products, but when you think about it, it's, even if you have a cheap course out there, whether you're selling it through Udemy or through your own website, and you have thousands of people who have taken it, it's not necessarily even about the money that adds up.

Although of course the money adds up, you have really become known in a certain category and certain niche that you wouldn't have been otherwise.

That opens up the opportunity for you to have virtual organizing packages where you can work more one-on-one with people.

There is a just, that's why it's really overwhelming because there are so many different routes that you can go.


So I'm going to try to talk you guys through this in an organized fashion.

However, that is my style is super casual and I do have a lot of little things that I'm, I know I'm going to want to share with you.

Y'all forgive me because I didn't, I just wanted to brain dump this out there and let you guys ask me questions.

I didn't want to make a course or a paid workshop about this.

I really wanted to share this because I have more ideas than I know what to do with in a day.

I would rather share them with you guys than hoard them all for myself, because I'm certainly not going to do them.

Anyway I need to grab a pen just in case I need to make a note.

The first thing I'm going to talk about is I'm going to go through types of, sorry, my glare.


1. I'm going to go through types of online products.

That might take a little bit of time because I really want you guys to open your mind and see how many different kinds of things that there are that you could create and sell.

Then we're also, well, I'm sorry, first of all, we're going to talk about big picture because I do have some big picture things that I want to say, then we're going to talk about types of products and then we're talk about as I go through those types of products and I'm going to talk about tools because that is a big question that I have gotten, even from my own family members.

They're, well, what platform do you use for your course? And how did people find you? For them to even know about it.

we're going to talk a little, I'm going to talk about all the behind-the-scenes stuff about tools as I go through the types of products and things that pertain to those different things.


And let me be the first one to tell y'all I have tried a lot of different things in my online business.

They have not always all been successful, but I have really tested a lot of different types of things.

I have also invested in my own learning a lot because I know that there is a lot that I don't know.

I have bought courses about some of this online business stuff.

Some of them have been great and some of them have just been okay.

At the end, I'll definitely give you guys some of my recommended people I would say here's a great resource for certain types of things.

I will share that as well.

We'll talk about tools, we'll talk about resources.

We'll also talk about just the process for creating a product.


Like how would I even go about that if I was going to make a group program and it was going to be six weeks, how would I do that? So we're going to talk about that.

We're going to talk a little bit about pricing and selling the product and then I'm sure we'll go back into some of the little things that I think are really important to know when it comes to being successful with this, because there is a lot in the people who teach online business, some of them I think are fabulous and other ones I think are really they, may have good intentions, but they don't come across very well.

They come across scammy and I feel I don't want you guys to get what's the word, I'll just give you what I feel is my opinion on <laugh> how much you need to know or to invest, because I feel there is always another coach that can help you invest to another new level.


And yes, there are always things you can improve, but I feel the greatest experience that you can have is putting yourself out there and teaching what getting feedback and then using that feedback to improve what you're putting out there that there is, I believe there is no better teacher than that.

To that end, I have made a lot of mistakes, but I don't really regret any of those because I feel well I learned, I learned whether or not that worked.

I learned whether or not that's something I'm comfortable doing again.

I'll just try my best to share that as we go.

I'm really excited that all of you guys are here.

So, let's move into this.

what I'm going to talk about is types, when I say bringing your business online, that may mean different things to different people, because some people I know they just might want a little extra thing that they sell on their website.


In addition to the services that they're already you're committed to selling services.

A. So this may be something that is a small project that you're thinking of doing, maybe it would be nice to have, a downloadable ebook on your website that costs $10.

That could be what you call a small project.

B. Some of you might be thinking I would really build a big enough audience that I can run my entire business from anywhere because it's not dependent on my location.

I can be on my computer, I'm running group programs or maybe one-on-one services that really almost replace you.

Coaching people one-on-one.

Let's just go ahead and differentiate, don't feel bad... A vs. B.

If your goal is not huge, that's fine.


And some of you might only still be just starting out with, in-person services.

You might feel this a little bit overwhelming.

Don't worry about that.

This is just something to soak in and just think about, so I promise you guys, I was going to start with the big picture and I, do have one big picture thing to tell you out of everything that I have learned over the past two years, with all the tools that I've tried with all the resources and courses that I have taken.

I would say that all along the way, every step of the way, the problem or my thing, and this is just part of growing.

But my, thing that I've had to correct for every step along the way was that I wasn't thinking big enough.

Obviously from the beginning, but even when I would take another step forward, it was, oh, now I got to go back in...


I'm not going to say "fix" it.

But it was, I was always having to go back and troubleshoot things that were happening behind the scenes, of course whether it was a tool that I chose that didn't really do everything I needed it to do.

I was stringing together a bunch of different things, an email provider with a website, with a course platform, that stuff.

that's the stuff that you don't see that eats up so much time.

I know that if you guys are really short on time, <laugh>, I might want to tell you, I feel, so few people will take this seriously, but if you're short on time, then you need to just think big from the beginning because you need to think, okay if I'm going to be serious with this, and if I'm going to pour my heart into something that I want to put out there and have it live out there, of course, again, not you can't improve it and change it, but if you're going to put your name on something people will find if you do the right things.


And if you follow some of the few directions that I have for you, people will find you.

So, let's chat about this.

What I'm going to do is I'm going to talk about an imaginary organizer with an imaginary niche and imaginary idea.

I do actually think it's a good idea, but, it might strike you guys as funny because it's really super specific.

that's my other big piece of advice is today when you are thinking about some, things that you might could do, I think the big thing is you have to think big.

the second thing is you have to think really specifically.

Here's the reason why is because what you guys want to do is you want to think of something that is an answer to a problem that a lot of people have.


But people don't just type anyone be thinking about things that people Google or search for on YouTube or search for on Pinterest.

We'll talk about all three of those things later on a little more nitty gritty, but people aren't just generally searching in Google.

Well maybe sometimes they are, "...I'm totally overwhelmed with my life."

We know they are, but they're more, this is exact example.

They're, what do I do with years of Christmas cards? What do I do with old Christmas cards? Because I'm not, I'm not even making this up.

One of my previous clients posted that on her personal Facebook page, two days ago.

All of her friends were, oh, you should make books out of it.

She's, I don't have time to do that.


She even said, I really just want somebody to give me permission to give them away, or recycle them.

Of course, I had to comment on that, but those are the things that people are actually searching for.

So, today the imaginary person that I thought up is going to be an organizer who, and I know y'all are going to think it sounds crazy, but that's why I think it's so funny.

It's going to be an organizer who specializes in organizing holidays, holiday organizing.

When you, at first glance, you're thinking that sounds crazy, who in my town is looking for somebody to come and only organize their holiday stuff, but hang in there with me, because what we're talking about is building a reputation and building a thing that you're known for that is way beyond just your local town.



Let's say, and now at first glance, this sounds very specific because you're, well, that only happens a few months of the year.

However, it's one of those things that people don't think about until the last minute, after Halloween.

Then it becomes this really overwhelming thing.

It's not only buying gifts, it's not only dealing with their disorganized addict.

It's dealing with family is dealing with food and meal plans.

It's everything.

So, and, just generally, the end of the year is really hard with work it's the end of the fiscal year or whatever for a lot of people.

It's a lot of stress.

So, let's say we have an organizer who's I'm really just going to focus on what is it going to take for, a person out there who it tends to have this same.


Oh, that's the other thing.

It happens every year.

It's predictable.

However, we tend to put things off until the last second.

This organizer is, what am I going to do to help people get to the point where maybe they just experienced the whole holiday season with less stress, because they've planned some of these things ahead, they've dealt with some of these things in the summer when it does not pressure on you.

let's, so let's talk through some of the types of products that this person could make.

1. So if we're on her website, so we're going to start with just free information, stuff that you don't have to enter in your email address for, you can just find so free information would be her website, her social media, her blog, and social media also would just include YouTube or any other videos or content that she puts out there.


That, again, sorry, I have this one hair bothering me again, that people can search for and that people would be searching for.

This would be things figuring out what are the types of things that people are searching for that relates to disorganization around holidays, holiday meal planning, how to, how I don't, I'm not really great at thinking of exact topics off the top of my head, but you guys are getting my drift, right? You would want to think of blog posts that you could write about that relate to that topic, videos that you could write about that would relate to that topic.

The whole thing is to get people who are already searching for precisely what you are the expert in, and that you have decided, this is going to be a thing that I can really help people with.


I didn't have to have a college degree in a holiday organizing to be able to put myself out there and say, this is something I specialize in.

You have you have lots of helpful DIY types of information.

That's either on a YouTube channel or the blog, or again, anything that's free information.

You want to think about, I've talked about this in the Inspired Organizer group.

You want to think about, and this is, you'll hear this in online marketing a lot, a funnel is shaped like this, obviously.

People up at the very top of the funnel get to you because you have this free, information that they can consume.

you would want to think about being found.

This is what I was talking about a second ago, being found when people are searching on Google, Pinterest and YouTube, those are three really, big things.


And in my own business in Pro Organizer Studio, those are the three things that I focused on in order to be found by people who are looking for exactly what I want to talk about or that I have to offer.

That's, free information and then the next so tools and resources for this, obviously if you already have your website, you have your tool, which is Squarespace or WordPress or whatever your website is social media.

Anyway, I won't get too much into that, but thinking about any, anytime you come across something that talks about content marketing, that's what they're saying.

You're putting out content that is helpful and valuable for people and answers their questions.

2. So the next level would be free information that is still free for them, but it is gated, and gated in online marketing would just mean anything that they have to enter in their email address for.


And the reason why this is important is that in the long, in the long run, anything that you're doing, that you need to sell online, you need to be building up an email list of potential leads.

Basically, it's the same as when you're selling in person organizing services; you're going to have a list of people who know you and are in, and who are interested in hearing from you.

Email marketing is a whole separate topic, but the number one biggest thing that I can tell you that I have learned in the last two years is not to be afraid to email the people who sign up for your email list.

Now, not to say you have to email them every day or even twice a week, but sending out a one little time a weekly newsletter.


It's if people don't want to hear from you anymore, they can unsubscribe.

But the reason why they're on your email list is not, what's the word you guys just, you shouldn't, you shouldn't feel nervous about that.

They signed up because they wanted something that you had.

Now that you, now that they're on your email list, you can continue to give them value.

You don't have to go straight into selling them something, but eventually, you are going to need to get comfortable with the fact that you will be using that to sell something.

Let's talk about what a gated free information product could be.

In my business, what mine was, and there is been several versions of this, but I had a free email course.

It was just called the free course.


At one point it was just a free download of the whole entire course.

But at one point it was seven-day automated email series.

I wasn't sending out those emails personally, but once they signed up, whenever they signed up, it would send them one email a day for seven days.

It to the tool that I used for that, Hey, Ashley, the tool that I used for that is my email list provider I started with and stayed with for a really long time was Convert Kit.

Convert Kit is not free if you're looking for a free version.

MailChimp is what you want to go with.

I'm pretty sure MailChimp has some automations.

I'm just not sure if they're free or not.

I'm not a MailChimp expert, but if you're looking for something free, that's what you need to start with.


But again, when you're thinking of long-term growth, you do not want to be switching email providers every six months or even every year.

You really want to find one that you feel comfortable with.

You know the design, you understand how it works and you can continue to grow with it for a long time.

Maitlin says, Mailchimp, automations are free.

That is awesome.

I don't think they even used to have automation several years ago, so I didn't even ever consider starting with them, but I'm very glad that is an option now.

Gated free information could be a free email course.

It could be a free ebook, and it doesn't have to be long, and obviously, you don't have to have it printed, but you basically write something up and turn it into a PDF.


That could be something that people enter their email address for.

Then they get an automated email back with your free ebook.

When you, when you create the, when you create the ebook, I was trying to say it needs to be something again, that is related to that niche we already talked about.

You already decided here's something that I can easily be the specialist in because there is nobody else specializing in this.

it's something I'm really passionate about and I'm willing to talk about all day long every day.

It's an important part of choosing your niche.

When you create that ebook, it needs to be something that, again, continues to give people value.

That's a little bit more than them stringing together four or five or six blog posts that they might have read on your blog.


It's here's something that's more laid out in order and gives you a little bit of structure, but it's still free.

They're, wow, that was really valuable.

That was really good.

Another idea for a gated free info product would be anything that is on your website that it's free, but they need to have a password to get into it.

If you guys have been around Pro Organizer Studio while we've had a lot of different things and, what's the word features.

What we used to have was a free resource library, but you had to enter in your email and then you would get an automated email that once you confirmed, then it gave you the password and you could go back and get in.

That would be an example of something you could put together a few resources that is behind a password-protected wall of some kind.


So, those are a few examples for that.

In, as far as to tools that you would use to create those I mean, in, square space, there is a password protected feature that is, free.

You can use it.

If you, once you have, now, this is getting a little bit complicated, but I just want to let you guys know it, all, it all integrates with each other, with your email provider, you would have a form that you would embed in your, in your website that once the person entered in their email they, on that page that says, Hey, I have this free resource library they'll enter in their email.

Your email provider will take care of the rest of it.

You don't have to sit there and hand out the password every day.



So, another example of a gated free info product would be a free Facebook group.

As you guys know, I had a free Facebook group for a very long time, and it's gated not in the sense that I have, everybody's email address that ever joined, but that they have to request to join.

With Facebook, they do have a feature where you have to you don't have to, but you can ask a question just to make sure that they answer the question, do you really want to be a professional organizer? Or you just trying to spam because face it, you will get a lot of spammer requests on Facebook.

You can tell because they're a member of 300 groups and is some random guy from another country, you're clearly not in the right place.


So that also, so the free Facebook group is also a little bit of a is gated in the sense, but you don't have them on your email list, but you do you have the opportunity to reach them easier than you would from your Facebook page.

Lots of things with Facebook change all the time with the algorithm.

Two years ago, anyway, when Facebook groups were still a new thing, it was more Facebook would show a group member all of the group posts, but only some of business pages that they follow as followed posts.

You guys understand what I'm saying nowadays? I'm not sure if it's exactly still that much more favored.

But it has been known as an easier way to connect with people on Facebook versus where with page posts, they don't get seen very much anymore unless you are, paying to have them boosted putting a little bit of money behind it, as a Facebook ad.


So let me talk, I'm going to pause on this subject for a little while, because I know a lot of people want to know, what are the pros and cons of having a free Facebook group? Well, first of all, the pro, I said, is that you have a way to let people have access to you for free.

That's a little more intimate and special than just them commenting on your blog and hoping that you comment back or commenting on your YouTube or whatever it is that you have.

That was the free thing.

If you guys remember, I'm just trying to make sure to paint this example.

You guys know if you guys remember what I, when I had my free, our free Facebook group for Pro Organizer Studio I would do the Facebook live chats in the group, and then I would repost them to YouTube.


And so then people would find them on YouTube, find those chats on YouTube and then come and join the group so they could participate in the chats.

If I were starting my business again, all over again today in some other way or whatever, I would still do exactly that strategy because nothing was more beneficial or successful in helping me get to know all of you guys and for people to find me on YouTube than doing that.

I mean, it still blows me away that people are, oh my gosh, I found you and I binge watch all your videos.

I'm, what? It's just me sitting here talking to my phone.

There is not anything more accessible for you to build a relationship with an audience than doing some type of video.


Again, it wouldn't have to be in a Facebook group.

You could do it on your Facebook page like this, but if you're me, <laugh>, I didn't want to do a Facebook video on a public page when I was starting out.

It's a really nice way for you to gain confidence.

I don't know if y'all remember this, but I started doing these videos when there were zero or maybe one, or two people in the group.

Then I would still do it every Tuesday at nine o'clock, even when there were only six people in the group.

It was just a commitment that I made.

I think the fact that I made it a public commitment, every Tuesday at night, I'd do a live chat I mean, we would take breaks here and there, but that is the consistency that helped grow that group.


And helped me get confident enough to do what I do today.

I had no idea that I had such a love for talking to people on the internet, but it I mean, it's something that I would not have been able to foresee at the beginning.

So, if you guys think at all that you want to do some type of video.

If you're comfortable doing this type of video chat and letting people get to know you that way, it becomes then a very natural next step for people to be willing to pay for you to be talking to them just one-on-one, because they already feel they know you, they're sitting, they're listening to you on video face to face all the time, but now they get the chance to talk back and show you their space or whatever it is that you have decided your, niche or your specialty is.


So those are some of the pros of the Facebook group.

The concept of Facebook group is that the more that it grows, it becomes, I mean, it's your life your notifications on your phone? I mean, because it's your group, you can't just ignore it.

Or at least that's not how I would do it.

It becomes very, time-consuming.

Again, this is a good thing.

If you have a strategy for what you're doing with it, if you're not, if you're not using it to let people know about the group program you have or whatever it is about your one-on-one services, if you're not using that group to sell.

When I say sell it, doesn't have to be constant, hard selling.

It can be very natural.

It's, by the way, this is something that I've had great success working with people one-on-one let me know, or not let me know, let me know if you're interested in getting on my schedule in the next month or what, however you want to say it.


That's just, Hey, it's not high pressure, but you're in this group.

You must be interested in this thing.

I think you guys, if you're really interested in doing a Facebook group, be comfortable with the fact that it's free for them, for a reason, it's because you do still have something very valuable to continue to help them with the next step in the journey.

I would say that's it's, a trade-off.

You have all your free time on your phone, which is easy, especially if you're working a part-time job right now.

You're thinking, I don't really have a way to build up more in-person clients.

You could be sitting on your phone, answering people in your Facebook group most of the day, if you can get away with it, not saying I told you to do that, but so, another suggestion I've given some people in the Inspired Organizer group is why don't you guys, because there is so much, if you're going to grow a group that really is really engaged and gives a lot of value either through video or whatever it is that you're going to do with it.


Teaming up with somebody another organizer, that's not one of your direct competitors in your city, or even if they are, I mean, maybe you do want to do it together if it's location specific, but teaming up with somebody else who's interested in the exact same topic you are and you guys could both run a group together and split up the responsibility of either doing video content or answering people's questions or, and then decide who's going to sell, what, or how are we going to make sure that our services aren't stepping on each others toes? That could be another, that could be another possibility.

Just something to think about.

I had another point I wanted to make about free groups.

I got to think about what it was.

The other benefit of a Facebook group is when it gets to be a certain size.


I think it was about a thousand people, but maybe it's even less than that.

Now Facebook will promote it for you basically as a, related group, for it knows, it knows what your interests are, right? So it will promote it to other people that they think would be in that group.

That's one benefit as well.

As it continues to grow, it grows itself because Facebook is promoting it.

Again, you get to a certain point where people join it and they don't know who you are, they didn't see your videos.

They didn't know <laugh>, they don't, they didn't find you the same way as the people did originally, but it still is a cool way.

As long as you are purposefully and thoughtfully driving them back to your website and letting them know a little bit more about who you are, who you help, and what your thing is.


So obviously having an on topic title for your Facebook group is really important.

I think that's everything I have thought of to say about free Facebook groups.

But if you guys have any questions about this, let me know and chat and I'll try to catch it.

I think I've gotten through my gated free info.

Step 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, that step two of six that I'm going to talk about.

Again, if you guys miss my intro, you might need a snack.

You might need a drink, you might need a nap in the middle of this chat, but, it doesn't bother me.

Just hang out, watch the replay, come back later.

It's totally fine.

Also, my husband texted me in the middle of that and said, I need to be quieter.

I don't know if I can do that.


It's not possible.

Step three, the next step in oh, I remember what I was going to say all, this is my last comment about free Facebook groups.

One of my friends in another niche, not organizing, had a free Facebook group that grew to be a large size.

She also had a group program that was only $50 a month.

It was, it was awesome.

It was insanely valuable for what it was.

She is an interior designer, so she was basically, you can, work with me.

<laugh> you can get my feedback at the drop of a hat with this group program and everything.

The problem was she was having people hesitate to join it because she was already answering questions at the drop of a hat and her free group.


And they're not the drop of a hat, but she was already giving them her opinion on their design choices or whatever it was that they were working on.

I would recommend that you figure out ahead of time what are the things that I am willing to answer and talk about in my free group and what is paid content be? And the reason why this is really important obviously is not just because it's not just because you're just trying to turn every single person into a paid member, but because the people who have paid to be a part of your inner circle deserve to be the ones who get that attention from you.

I think it's really important to protect your, their investment and their relationship with you by not still continuing to answer every single question that comes up in detail and your free group.


So if you're free, if you do have a free group of some kind decide, here are the levels of things that I can help people with for free versus you're going to need to join my group program, or you going to need to work with me one-on-one to really get what you're looking for out of that.

I know that's hard is very, it was very hard for me, but it's just something that everybody's going to have to decide at some point, if you're going to have an online business and stuff.

That was the last thing.

3. Cheap information product.

This is next.

This is our next level.

This is something that would cost $7, $9, something you think of as being super, cheap, not something that you are going to think, oh, this is going to make me tons of money this year.


It could make you some money.

But the main thing is it's something that people get a little bit more of a next step with you.

It shows you, this is an important point, too.

It shows you who is willing to even put a dollar or $9 into their results.

Let's go back to this imaginary organizer we're talking about with, she's going to eventually lead people down to her group program, which is a year-long program where she's got monthly lessons and not lessons, but homework and more of a structure of, here's things that we're going to do throughout the year to ensure that your holidays are a success and that you're not scrambling and that you're not stressed and that you don't gain 10 pounds.

Obviously there is all these benefits.

So, as we're leading, so let's say she's got her free information on her website.


She's got a free Facebook group.

Maybe if she wants to do that maybe she just says that little membership area, the password-protected membership area, where she's got some free printable downloads of things that you can plan out, ahead of time for the holidays.

Then maybe she even has a list of, here's what you can do every month of the year, to work a little bit so that when you get to the holidays, everything's done, everything's planned, blah, blah, blah.

When you get to the cheap info product level, maybe this organizer wants to, she could do, she has maybe even created free mini course.

That would be the I'm sorry, not free cheap, a cheap mini-course, a $9.

Mini-course two weeks to get to a certain result that is related again to this Christmas niche or, holiday niche in general.


And, the purpose of this would be not so much to make the $9 off of the course, but it's, oh, here's a look at what my teaching style is.

Here's a look at the type of projects and steps that you can expect from me if you were to commit to working with me for a longer period by the way, <laugh> actually love this Christmas idea.

I hope you guys are all thinking of different ideas right now.

Something applying this information to your thing.

When you, when you're thinking about making a mini course, it can be it can, it can be a paid, again, I'm just going to say $9 because we're thinking cheap, no brainer.


It can be an email course where you get an automated email from me every day for three weeks,21 days to make a habit.


I don't know what, however, you're going to make this relate to your niche.

You can make it, you can, there are ways that you can do that.

It can also be actually, instead of just an email course, it can be actually hosted on a course platform using one of the free plans.


We're going back to tools here for a second.

Teachable is the course platform that I started out with and they do have a free level.

It doesn't give you tons and tons of features and benefits.

Obviously everything is branded Teachable or whatever.

But it's a way to start and when you put even a three week, three weeks of lessons, or, you know little steps and reminders for people even creating a small change for them in that three weeks, that's very powerful because then people start to believe, oh, well, if I can do, if I can do this three-week program.


And if I saw that, if I saw that change, I now have the confidence that I can continue to get the ball rolling.

You guys always also have to think about everything I'm talking about.

I'm trying to relate it back to the types of clients that we work with.

They need to make small changes.

<laugh>, you don't want to overwhelm them and say, we're going to organize your whole house.

Sign up for my course to do that.

It's going to cost $500.

It's, no, they're not going to, even if that's cheaper than working with you, they're not going to, just take that step.

you need to be thinking about how to get them to build up the belief in themselves and also get a taste of what is it really taking one of your courses and working with you one-on-one,what is the quality that they can expect and that, type of thing.


I think that's a really powerful idea.

Some other cheap information products would be we talked about doing a free ebook.

You could do a cheap ebook as well, that actually cost them some money.

Maybe that could be even a longer, more full version of the free one that you, that you gave them.

Something again, I mentioned printable a minute ago in the free password-protected area.

That could be one thing you could also sell printables.

I know a lot of organizers do that or they sell home organizing binders.

You could do something that.

That is very related to your niche and your specialty.

We're going to pause in a second for a pop quiz.

***Why do we want a niche? That is that specific.

I'm going to answer, I'm going to answer, but I hope you all get it right in your head.


We're just, and I already said this, I just want you to revisit this because you really need to get this drilled in your head.

You want a niche that is so specific that your mom is, what the hell are you doing? Because you need something that people are actually specifically searching for.

When they search for it, they don't just want any old person's answer.

They want your answer because this is what you do.

This is what you're all about.

Oh, why would I get just any old organizer's answer about Christmas organizing when I can get the Christmas organizing specialist answer on Christmas organizing, right? it's just that little next-level thing that is going to make you stand out.

again, it helps you build that email list.

It's all these things that are beneficial to you in the long run for being able to sell something.


But it doesn't work if you're too general from the beginning.

So, one of the things I said at the beginning was if you really want to save time, you need to think big, think, about your business, getting big, and then also think super narrow with your niche.

Side note, I should have said this at the beginning, probably too.

When you're thinking about your audience that you're trying to reach.

I also really think that it's a time saver, very beneficial for you to be thinking about an audience that you yourself are part of, because the name of the game at the end of the day is you have to, if you're going to be able to have an online business, you need a large number of people, a large enough number of people that trust you.

I think that one of the shortcuts to being trusted is to share your own struggles.


And you don't have to be 10 miles down the road from where they are.

You only need to be a couple miles down the road from where they are, here are the things that I have experienced in, my life or in with this situation.

Maybe for example, you've gone through a divorce and that's now years behind you, but here's some things you wish you would've known.

You know what I mean? You don't have to be a divorce expert.

It's just, Hey, I went through this and I know what it's like.

Right? So, when you guys are thinking about that audience, it's so much easier.

I feel this is the most generic advice that drives me crazy online is they're always talking about getting to know your ideal customer, surveying your ideal customer and finding out what they want.


I'm maybe, but who better than anybody else is yourself.

I think that what you personally struggled with and what, resources you wish you would've had at that time.

I think that again, you can create that product that you wish you, that you wish you had, or you wish you had come across.

Then again, later on, you can still come back and improve it once you have actually had real other people, buy it and say, this was awesome.

Here, are the questions I still have.

You can go back and incorporate all that back into it.

it's something that can continue to live and evolve, but I don't think you need to spend a year doing market research on what your ideal customer wants.


Like go ahead and make something that in your heart, you know is needed.

Especially if you have noticed that there is something that really needs to be said that nobody else is saying go, I mean, be the one to step forward and say I know we talked about this Inspired Organizer recently, all the Christmas gifts is just, is too much.

How do you set boundaries with your family members that want to give you stuff?Until you die? I mean, all these things that you, feel in your heart, other people feel it too, and other people are searching for solutions for the same things.

That was my side note.

Be a member of the audience, obviously that you're trying to reach because you know their struggles intimately, since you have been there, you'd also do a cheap membership area.


If, again, if you guys hung around, you know the resource library has been paid.

It has been free.

It now is in a totally different format.

When I first started it, was only $6 a month or $7 a month.

I used if you're looking for a tool for that I use an app or a third party site called Member Space because, and that's for Squarespace, it's a member, it's a membership.

It gives you membership capabilities for you to be able to protect your content.

Nobody can just get the password and go into it.

You can charge whatever you want.

That could actually be your cheap information product, or maybe that could be a more expensive one.

If you have really good content that people would pay monthly to stay in, to stay in that membership area.

Member Space, if you're using Squarespace, if you're on WordPress there is probably a lot more and, a lot more expensive ones, but just Google, membership plug in for WordPress.

The next step…


I missed one.

I told y'all, it was, there are so many, so many options.

This is a brand new thing.

Facebook is rolling out the ability for you to charge a monthly subscription or membership to, Facebook groups.

I haven't personally seen that option yet.

I'm not going to do that.

I'm not going to charge for the group itself, but that would be something that would be another example of, instead of doing a membership area on your website, you could have a paid Facebook group that you just directly charge access to, instead of having to do it separate where you have a separate subscription and then you have to let them into the Facebook group separately.

That could be another thing that you think about utilizing that could be something that could be your, cheap information product, or that can even, you can even end up using that for your paid, group program type of thing that you want to do.


That's more expensive and you give you give a lot more.

I would just say though, that obviously one of the big differences with a paid Facebook group versus a paid membership area on your website is that in the Facebook group, people will expect you to answer the questions and be more present.

That's why I think that's better for a more of a group program option.

Because at that level they are going to expect a little bit more support from you versus at the cheap information product.

However, you want to go about it, just be thinking about what people are used to on certain platforms.

4. So the next thing is the medium level information product.

This would be something that is $29.

I'm just throwing out these prices randomly.

They could be anywhere from$15 to $50.


Like whatever you feel is medium.

When I'm talking about this medium information product, I'm still talking about something that is a little bit more, it's not just a $7, $9 thing, but it's something that they pay a little bit more money for, but they're not going to be getting one-on-one support with you for it.

This would be something not just that mini course, but a DIY course that you created, for example this is the type of thing I've seen a lot of, or some, not a lot.

The organizers who are creating courses are creating that type of learning experience.

For example, a photo organizing, do it yourself, photo organizing course.

I've seen a lot of that.

Do it yourself, paperwork, decluttering, that, type of thing.

It's, a paid course that is not just cheapy cheap.


Like maybe it's $50, but they're not expecting to get there is no support that you're offering for them.

Then another, example of a medium price information product would be a book, you know? Now it doesn't have to be, again, it doesn't have to be a book that you print.

It could be, well, we're going to talk about that in just a second, but the, this, I want you to put a star next to this, medium level information product, either just a, do it yourself course.

You don't give them group support.

You don't do any one-on-one stuff other than of course, customer service, if things come up.

But either that course, or writing a book again, it can be, self-published, it does not, doesn't have to be that hard, but if you were going to start with something, say, right now, all you have is your free information that you already have, and you have your one-on-one service.


By the way, the one-on-one service that we sell is the bottom of the funnel, because it is the most expensive and should be the most expensive.

You are, you being in person doing one-on-one coaching with somebody should be the most expensive out of all those things.

Just in case you're listening to this and you didn't know <laugh>, you should not be only charging $25 an hour to organize people, and that is what I teach in my course Inspired Organizer.

I teach about package pricing.

I teach about charging, more, getting better clients and all that stuff.

So, and we're not even, we're not even going to talk about the one-on-one part because that's in person and we're talking about everything in between that could be online, but if you're going to start with one level, I would start with that medium thing.

Here's the reason why, because if you, let's say, if all you had before was a website in your social media, and then you're selling this really expensive one-on-one service, how powerful do you think it would be for you to be one out of all the organizers in your area? 

I'm still talking about selling one-on-one services that you've written a book about your specialty <laugh> or you've created a, an online course about your specialty.

I think it is extremely powerful in helping you, I mean, obviously you can make money from that medium sized product, but I think it can be extremely powerful in helping you sell more of your in-person services, because don't people want to work with somebody who's written a book about the thing that they need help with.

It's, just very powerful in people's minds in terms of expertise.

Again, you know how you price your book is totally up to you, but when I'm talking about a medium level, It’s not just a, it's not a 10 page ebook, this is more of a book that people can either download or they can buy.


So if you were thinking about doing this hats off to you, I would love to write a book, but I'm not there yet.

You can self-publish it very easily.

What you want to Google and teach yourself and learn about is going through Amazon self-publishing that means you upload it.

When somebody wants to buy it, they print it and ship it to them.

Obviously you're going to want to buy one for yourself.

You're, Hey, friends and fam I'm an author.

<laugh> so that's really cool, but you don't have to handle any of the logistics of where, who am I publishing this with? Where, how am I getting this printed? How am I getting these shipped to people?You don't have to deal with any of that stuff.

It's really amazing.

You actually, I mean, you keep, I wouldn't say a super high percentage, but you keep a much higher percentage than you would with a traditional publishing deal.


You have total control over what you say in it and how it how your message comes across.

If you guys are interested more in this conversation, I did a Facebook live chat on my page here, but now it's on YouTube.

If you want to see it there with Jennifer Ford, Barry she's a, great friend of mine and she's written several books.

We talk all about this in that chat.

That was our topic.

You guys definitely want to go back and check that out.

She talked all about the ups and downs of having a book deal versus self-publishing and some of the struggles and things that she's learned because now she wants to have total control over her material.

I think, again, that was an example of not thinking big enough from the beginning and now that her books have been translated into other languages.


And now that she's written five, some of those little issues that didn't seem like a big deal at the beginning now are a much bigger deal to her.

I think you will learn a lot from that chat.

Make a note of that.

Then going back to my other idea for that medium level information product, obviously if you can help people, if you have a topic, if your niche lends itself to this, it might not be for everybody.

Maybe, for you, just want to skip to the group program.

Beth said her daughter is a book editor for a self-publishing company.

What are you waiting for? What are you waiting for?.

If your niche lends itself to you creating a course where you put all of your knowledge into a do it yourself course where you can take them through four modules or eight modules.


I have a, I have so much to share with you about how to create a course.

It is probably, I don't know if it's harder or at least as hard as writing a book at least in my case, but I do have some tips for you.

First of all, let's talk about tools.

I started on teachable.

I now have my, all of my courses.

I moved over to a platform called Kajabi, K a J a B I and that again was one of my personal growth curves learning curves.

I, because again, <laugh>, I didn't know this was going to be the, core of my business.

When I started and teachable is cheaper and it's easier to use so absolutely use what is, what use what you feel comfortable with, especially if you consider yourself, not a super technical person.


I mean, there are so many course platform options.

Now I haven't used most of them obviously, but there is one called think that is really easy.

I would highly recommend, even though I mentioned this earlier, I would highly recommend not going with Udemy.

I don't know, course, Sarah what is the other one called Skillshare? There is a lot of other course platforms that you can sell a course through, but they're going to take most of your money and if you're going to make a course, do it on, do it and host it and sell it yourself so that you can get the money back out of it.

I wouldn't recommend going that direction, even though again, you can get a lot more exposure to you know the traffic of the kinds of people that want to buy an online course about decluttering their paperwork.


But if you're only making $2 every time somebody sells it every time somebody buys it, I mean, it's just a lot of competition based on price.

I just would not recommend doing that.

Teachable is what I started with Kajabi is what I have now.

Kajabi is more of an all in one solution for a lot of the things that I do in my business.

I, to me, it helped me solve a lot of things where I was stringing together, my email provider with my website square Convert Kit, Squarespace, teachable.

I had to have, that other third party integration platform helped do a lot of things automatically.

It was behind the scenes, it was everything pasted together.

Now with Kajabi, I feel everything is actually all in one place.


And it works together for, my needs really well.

I have been really happy with moving over to that, with that option.

Kajabi also gives you again, if you're thinking big, if you're thinking big Kajabi also gives you a lot more flexibility on how your stuff appears.

For example, every teachable course looks exactly the same.

It looks great.

You got things laid out by module.

You can check it off, you can upload videos, you can upload worksheets, you can upload texts.

You can basically put everything in it, but it always looks the same as every other teachable course.

Whereas with Kajabi, I feel my stuff looks more professional, especially when I rebranded and upgraded with Inspired Organizer.

Everything is, it looks a lot better and it looks different than my other courses and it looks different than everybody else's other courses.


So I've been really happy with that.

I also use Kajabi as my email provider now, so I was able to consolidate a lot of different tools that I had been using since the beginning and got it all moved over.

Again, I said, you can't, you can't avoid evolving and having to change tools sometimes.

But when you do have to change a tool and you're, I'm going to be spending the next three to five days of my life, figuring all this out unless you are, super, I mean, I would consider myself high, medium technical savvy.

I have a lot of experience with a lot of different things and it still is just annoying.

If you hate technical stuff well, if you hate technical stuff, online business might not be the right route for you, but you might just want to go with something that's a little, even if it's $20 a month more, then the other thing go with the thing that gives you more flexibility from the beginning so that you don't have to have these technical upgrade headaches later on again, thinking big, there are always people that can help you too, though, if you get stuck, I think you can hire somebody from five and get your stuff moved over from one platform to another.


But I'm just saying, you got to think about every time you do something that is online, there is a technical support component, not just for you, but for your students.

You have to be able to help them say well, if I can't log into my thing, what are the instructions? That type of thing, payment, managing payment plans, all that stuff behind the scenes.

There is that pro and con, but I'm assuming if you're still with me, you're, I'm willing to handle that if I can have part of my business be location independent.



That covered my medium information, product, medium level information products that don't include any support with you.


The next thing would be oh, by the way, let's go back to our Christmas person.

Let's say our Christmas organizer ends up writing a book about all the stresses that go into holidays and how nobody ever thinks of these things until the last minute.

There is it's not just it's money, stress, it's food, stress, weight, stress it's work stress into the year.

It's family stress.

Even if she's going to, this is the point I want to make, even though she's going to end up making a group program where it's, all right, we're going to spend a year and we're going to have dedicated topics and themes each month so that we have we arrive at our destination and we're all in one place and we're not super stressed and this year's going to be different because we planned it out ahead and organized it and blah, blah, blah.


I don't know.

Even if she's going to do that, she can still write a book about basically the same stuff that she's going to be teaching in that course in that group program.

But the value of the group program is you get the one-on-one support with the expert, which is you and, what people really, want and need more than anything is not to read another book.

They need their hands held throughout the process.

To break it down into simple steps, it's all this sounds so good.

Again, think of your niche, all this sounds so good, but tell me what the next thing to do and make me accountable for it.

I want to be held accountable for it.

That's why I'm so glad that I paid money for it.

They can buy a $20 buck and be, that sounds awesome, but I know I won't do it on my own.


So anyway, so when you're thinking about as your medium-level information product, if you do a book, it doesn't have to be substantially different in content from your group program that you're creating.

That's a win-win.

Let's move on to the next level, which is that's, I'm calling it a large information product.

For organizers, again, this could be a bigger course, it, there could be a lot of different things, but I feel for organizers, the group program is a really good way to go be for, the reason of what it is.

We're working with people on mostly it's stuff that they need to make small steps consistently.

It's stuff that if they don't maintain it, it's just going to get a mess again.

So, having a monthly format is a good, probably digestible amount of information and support and accountability and check in versus saying, let's organize your whole house in six weeks.


It's the, time frame is not right.

The motivation doesn't match up.

It's just in terms of them getting results.

I think having a, monthly program that has a specific and sorry, it doesn't have to be for a whole year, but it could be for three months and you check in every two weeks or you could do a whole year and you have once a month check in, it could just be something that has some rhythm to it and has a definite beginning and a definite end.

Because I don't think that the type of people who need to get organized in any area of their life, they, I don't, I don't think they benefit as much from just being a member of a community that for example, you're charging $50 a month, my interior designer friend, and just saying, well, you just you get access to me get designer expert feedback on, your home projects at any time.


I think that we need to in our industry be a little bit more purposeful where it's join this group program because we are working on this specific project is not just get access to me anytime you want.

Although I understand why that sounds enticing.

I feel, you know we need to be, we need to have a little bit more purpose in structure to what we're offering for it, for people to actually want to sign up for and be, oh this is $90.

This is totally doable or whatever.

It's six weeks and it's about this topic and this is exactly what I came searching for her for.

I'd rather work with this expert online in her group program and have her get to know me than hire somebody even to come to my house.

That is just not, a known expert in this topic.


So you can see why people would choose that.

Going back to another big difference with the large, the group program versus that medium size DIY course is you are offering some type of personal support and it doesn't have to be that you're in this group chatting and doing video every day, but just that there is some access to you.

However, the thing though is, that it is still on your time, you as the organizer, you're running the program and you have this group program, but it's not people expect an instant answer if they post a question and you're paid, let's say you're doing a paid Facebook group and it's for three months and it's on a certain topic.

Because you got to plan this out with your own life.


It's during this three months, I need to be available a little bit every day because it's only for three months.

You can't just ghost them for two weeks.

That's a huge part of the program.

You say to yourself during this three months, I'm going to spend an hour every day, but when it works for me, it's not going to be you don't have to commit to a certain time frame so that people are just, why aren't you online? I really feel you as you're doing a group program, they are still, if they want to have access to you at a certain appointment time, they need to make an appointment and pay for that.

One-on-one so I think, just be clear on, what, the difference is with those things.


So with your group program just we're talking about with the book, I mean the content the steps, but this is really deciding a timeframe and deciding what the end result is and breaking it down for them.

I think the mistake that probably everybody makes is biting off a little bit too much for each week or each month that you're in the program because we think this stuff is easy, but for everybody else who's living their real life and who is actually struggling with this thing they need it to be small wins <laugh> so, going back to our Christmas, organizing expert, let's say she did a program from February until November.

I was thinking10 months because you wouldn't want it probably to go through the Christmas holidays because you actually want to have a break during that time.


So let's say you break it down into 10 months.

You have 10 topics that you've thought out and 10 lessons and 10 things we're going to focus on.

That once a month we're going to give a little bit of thought and prayer and energy towards our holiday season by either shopping ahead, planning ahead, going ahead and organizing our Christmas decorations when it's I don't know, after, I, don't know again, I said, I'm not really great at thinking of the exact specifics off the top of my head, but you guys know there is so much that go, that can go into that.

That can be done ahead of time.

That by the time they get to the holidays at Thanksgiving, everything is I can actually enjoy my family because I'm not scrambling.

Because I didn't plan again this year anyway, do people actually wait till black Friday to start shopping? 

Like I guess that's what most people do.

Side note.

The group program is something that you were leading them through, but they have made that commitment.

I just said this a minute ago, I'm going to repeat it.

They've made that commitment financially, which helps people stay accountable.

They don't want to just dip out on that thing that result that they're excited about.

You're helping them stay accountable by being with a group of people and by the fact that they've paid for it, If it's free and nobody needs another free thing, people need to actually move forward and make progress.

Usually the only way they'll do that is, by investing some money.

Now another big selling point of this type of thing and you I'm sure will want to bring this up either on your sales page or when you're talking to people about it in your free group or whatever.


However it is that you're educating people about this special program and special experience with you is that it's a fraction of the cost of what it would be to work with.

You one-on-one either in person or even one-on-one virtual coaching.

That's a huge benefit.

I think a lot of people will really appreciate the fact that you, that you pointed that out because they're, Ooh, I get a piece of her brain, the expert's brain for hardly anything at the cost of what it would be to work with her in person.

I know that thing is very enticing to me when I see it a chance to work with somebody who I really respect.

I want her opinion more than anything.

It's cheaper for me to make the commitment, invest in myself.


Gosh, I love that word.

I love people who understand that how important that is.

You want to invest in yourself you want to make the investment, they're getting a bargain still.

It's, oh, I'm making this investment and I know I'm going to get the results, but it's, far less than it would cost me to work with a person one-on-one.

That's a really smart way for you to always be framing the benefits compared to something else at first somebody might look at your group program and be, oh it's $185 for, three months.

It's, yeah, well, if you're working with me, I mean, not that you have to say it this, but it's, Hey, this is a 10th of the cost of what it would be for me to work with an organizer one-on-one in your home and you get access to me during that entire time.


So always be comparing it favorably to what the other options are, you know? So that was a little moment on how to sell it.

The last level of working with people online as far as I can tell <laugh> is selling virtual organizing packages, which would be just you selling a package I teach with regular organizing, but you are committing to a series of however many, you know coaching sessions, which could be on FaceTime or Skype.

If you, if you guys are interested in this, the number one resource I have for you is my interview that I did with Nikki Boyd, who this is her entire business now she does do in-person organizing, but Nikki was a YouTuber.

She still is a YouTuber.

She's a very well known YouTuber actually who just loved organizing.


She had never worked with other people before, but she decided to launch organizing services in her hometown and virtual organizing at the same time.

Well guess what, because Nikki has, at the time, I think she had 300,000 YouTube subscribers.

I don't know how big her email list was, but again, she'd been growing that email list which, I said, y'all at the beginning really, smart in the long-term.

If you ever want to sell something, you got to have people you can email about it so that they know about it.

She said when they launched it on the email list, she, I mean, she's booked out with virtual organizing just from that.

She has a team of other people who go and do organizing in Charleston.

But her main thing is doing virtual sessions with people all over the world who already know her.


you can watch that.

You can watch that interview on, my YouTube or I just last week posted it as a blog post that has been transcribed and cleaned up.

If you prefer to read things rather than watching or listening to my speech idiosyncrasies it's not, it's on my block.

You can read, you can read the interview with her and we talk about so in my world, virtual organizing to me, if I was doing it is more I'm creating a project plan and then we have check-ins we talk about obstacles, blah, blah, blah.

In Nikki's world.

She is literally sitting with people on FaceTime and they are organizing their room and they've got the phone set up so they can see it.

She's coaching them through that saying, Hey you don't need five of those or whatever <laugh>.


And that pretty much blew my mind because it, for my personality, I never would've thought, oh, people really just want you to sit there with them and talk them through.

She said, yes, they love it.

They want her opinion.

They feel they know her.

It's again, it's cheaper than hiring an in person organizer.

They feel they're sitting there it's gold.

They are hanging out with their favorite celebrity.

That's incredible.

Obviously what she did I don't think she ever would've predicted or projected that was going to be her business.

But she just reading that blog post is an amazing case study in what it, what it means to build an email list of people that know you and love you and trust you.

Please go study that if that's something you're interested in, you don't have to, of course become a famous YouTuber in order to do virtual organizing all along the way, all along the way from all these things that we've gone through your free info, the free information you give on your website and your social media even in the book that you write or even in your group program, you can say, and we have the opportunity to work one-on-one together.


Here's what I offer for that.

Some I told y'all at the beginning, I was going to mention it, just a few things that bug me about online business in general, some people some online business coaches, I guess, or whatever would tell you that.

Because it's not, this is just my list.

It's not drawn out a funnel.

But remember that funnel was talking about he started at the top and that's a lot of, a lot of people.

Then you'd going down to the bottom, which is your expensive services, your one-on-one services.

Some people would tell you if you really want to grow your business, that there should never be an end to the funnel.

If you have a hundred people in your group program and you have 10 people that are working with you, one-on-one virtually that, then there should be one or two people who are who are working with you, not just on a, that are more, they're committed to even bigger package with even more exclusive attention with you.


Basically they say there should never be an end of the things that you're selling to people.

In my exploration of what I'm comfortable with and what I really feel is right for me and the trust and the audience that I have.

I don't, I don't, maybe it's just because of my stage of my life.

I, want there to be an end, because I don't want the people who I'm really close with.

Again at the bottom of the funnel here, those are people that I've invested a lot of relationship time with and I don't want them to feel, but there is always a next thing that I'm trying to get them to buy unless they just want to.

But, I that's, my point is, some, business coaches will tell you, well, the answer to your problem is just to create another offer and in problem just means growing your business.


And I just tend to say, there is got to be an end point.

Now there is when, in terms of, in terms of growing an online business, I will say, I didn't even write this down.

I told you, I wasn't going to talk about one-on-one services because that's offline.

But you could potentially, and I think again, this would depend very greatly on your niche.

I don't think this is going to work for the Christmas organizing lady.

But you could, if you had a really specific specialty, especially if it had anything to do with an emotional support type of thing, you could do an in person retreat that where you invite people who are on your email list, who know you because they met you online, not because they live in your area you could invite them to an an in person experience where you spend three days together and I don't know what you talk about, but again, there is that there is that opportunity.


I think if you, if it's the right match for what you teach and who you are, but again, that would be, I think that would be a really special situation.

<laugh> so y'all tell me, is there any online product that I didn't cover or type of tool that I didn't talk about? So what I was going to say though, was, is you could have a group program that has some existing, core material and then your group could be the support and the ongoing access to you.

That would be similar to what, to what I've done.

Or you could not even have core material.

I have been a part of a paid online group for a really specific business purpose that the, lady who ran it she got some people to join.

She got some people to join at the beginning and then she basically took a survey of all of the topics that we needed to learn as business owners.


And she mapped out 12 months of content and then she posted schedule and said, here's what we're going to be doing the whole year.

You don't even have to have this existing content for them to consume.

Then have you be the support on, you could almost plan out the content and deliver it, drip it out over the year, for example, our Christmas thing is a really good example because you could say July's the time when we should start thinking about Christmas presents or whatever.

I'm not sure I have a couple other things to talk about.

I'm just not sure what to what to jump to next, I guess, because y'all, aren't really commenting a lot.

I'm, are you, are you stuck on something I said, or are you totally overwhelmed or you're thinking, how do I go about this? 

You want to just talk about a process for creating, let's talk about a process for creating a course.

Does that sound big and scary? Let me talk a little bit about my experience and again, if I see questions, I'll try to go back to them.

Danielle said just a lot of information.


Kylie said she's driving.

Don't text and drive girl.

Talk a little bit about my experience with creating a course and what I was thinking and where I even got this idea to begin with.

Because I know that there was a lot of fears and hesitations and times so many times that I almost was, I'm just going to scrap this whole idea.

Just something kept me going with it.

I, want to talk a little bit about that.


So a lot of you be thinking why would anybody buy a course about my topic when there is so much free information on the internet already? And that was a real that I wouldn't say that was a really big thing in my case, because I really felt I had something different to say, however, I know that was, I know that that's a thing.

Here's the reason why, and this is the reason why I've bought a lot of courses, even when even when the information is probably out there, I could probably YouTube it, I could probably Google it.

I could probably figure it all out.

Eventually the reason why is because information on the internet is all over the place is not organized in an order that I need to go in and there is not enough structure to it.


That's going to okay, good Kelly said, this will be helpful.

There is not enough structure to it that I would be able to move through it meaningfully to get to that end result quickly.

So, the thing that you keep having to tell yourself is people want to do less thinking and less researching and less figuring it out on their own.

They want one person to be, here's what we're doing next and here, and I get a lot of confidence.

For example, when I take other courses I'm going through things in the right order and that I'm not missing things.

Now in my case, I've taken a lot of business courses versus personal organizing courses.

However, if somebody, if one of you guys could make a course that was, here is the definitive answer.


And again, it doesn't have to be it can just be your definitive answer.

It doesn't have to be the definitive answer.

But if you could give me the definitive answer on how, and I'm specifically, I have a Mac computer, I've got an iPhone, I've got photos, digital photos already.

They're already all scanned in.

I know that they're all there, but give me a definitive start to finish.

Here's what you need to do to get all of your photos organized once and for all.

Here's a process for you to keep up with it once a month or every two months for the rest of your life so that you don't have this scattered amount of digital photos, I would pay any one of you guys who could obviously show me what I'm getting and show me that, this is really going to get me that result.


And it's not going to take me eight months.

It will on my own any one of y'all pay $250 right now to have that information.

That's just an example of, I'm so tired of trying to figure it out and I want somebody who's going to lead me through it.

That would be one of those medium information products, guys.

I wouldn't be expecting you to, provide me support about it.

It would just be, you're going to get it done.

Here's what we're going to do.

It I've got a course about it.

It's thorough, it's made for exactly your situation.

That's one of the, I'm sure one of the fears is there is a lot of free information out there.

What makes me different here? The reason why it's different is that you're actually going about it in an organized manner.


Another, I think another big fear, and this was definitely one of my fears about creating a course is feeling it had to be massive really big and make sure it covered every single thing.

One really good piece of advice I got early on is you actually don't want it to be super long because you actually want your person to get to their result or their transformation or whatever the benefit is of why they sign up for it.

You want them to get to that result as soon as possible.

You don't want to be sign up for this.

In six months you might have that result.

It's more do this and in six weeks, if you could stay consistent with it we're going to have reach these specific outcomes.

Don't feel it, and, another big piece of advice I got was if you can, if you can write six blog posts, you can create six modules of a course.


Like if we're really thinking about doing a course, I think that the benefit of doing a group program is you can just come up with the topics.

If you feel comfortable talking on video,at length, I obviously do and providing the support of course of whatever questions come up, then it can be a little bit more on the fly and you don't have to plan it all out in advance and read off of a script and feel it has to be perfect.

I'm not good with that.

I, I like to be perfect.

That's the problem <laugh> so, with, doing this type of, interaction because it's unscripted, but with my course, and course, It's much more methodical, detailed, and I speak a lot slower and I record it and I edit out all the ums and weird stuff that I say.

Depending on your personality type, that might be a, deciding factor for you.

Christ said people want instant gratification in a plan of action with they step by step process.

Yes, that's literally all I don't who that's, all I want is just step by, step on everything.

Tell me what to do.

Then I think another big thing that, what was I nervous about when I started doing this?, The length? 

I don't know.

I can't remember what I was going to say.

I just wanted to get it done.

I really felt I had a burning passion for something that I felt needed to be said, and that I wanted to teach.

Oh, maybe feeling you needed to be a certified expert in something.


And I would even make that part of your, part of your selling point is I'm not this, for example, let's say your niche is something about something about being a mom with young kids, because for example, that's a huge audience.

That's some, an audience, a lot of you guys are already part of already or have experience with that.

You don't have to be I'm a child raising expert.

It's, but just I've been there.


And I'm a little bit further down the road than the people who are just now starting with, they just had their second kid, they just had their third kid.

It's, oh my God, am I going to manage all this? You, know what I mean? You just have to be a few steps ahead of your audience.

You don't have to be, again, the certified international expert on child raising and kids and organizing that thing and going back to marketing.

If somebody else asked me a question about, she said, I, figured out a niche going back, Jan said, I've thought of a niche, but I'm not sure how to reach my target audience.

Jan is about thinking about what your target audience, what are the problems that they are already searching for? 

Like what would they be actively searching for online? And this would be things that they're typing into Pinterest, things that they're typing into Google and things that they're typing into YouTube and creating cont.

And, I know people can find you other ways, but I feel starting there is really smart because you're starting with the people who are actively searching for you.

Then again, you can grow later and ask people to share with a friend or get testimonials.

I grow beyond that later.

But I think starting with people who are actively looking for you is, easier to get some momentum going on it.

Creating content and on Pinterest and Google and, YouTube, all three is all about search engine optimization, which is key making sure that the keywords that people are actually searching for are in your titles and in your descriptions for all three of those things.


Your, so this be putting content on your blog, pinning it to Pinterest having nice images on Pinterest that people want to click on filling out the descriptions on your pins and pinning those to not just your own boards, but to group boards where people are sharing ideas that are around that same topic.

If you guys are really, I, promise you, I would share with you some resources that I do love and trust.

Who I learned everything about Pinterest from is a girl named Melyssa Griffin, it's Melyssa with a Y.

I took her course on Pinterest.

It's called Pinfinite Growth.

That was how I was able to grow my Pinterest really pretty quickly YouTube, I did not take a course on YouTube and I don't even know of anybody who sells a course on YouTube, but YouTube was a major part.


And I told you guys at the beginning doing the Facebook live content in Facebook and then reposting it to YouTube and making sure that those descriptions had the topics and oh, Jan says she just listened to Melyssa's webinar today.


She's good.

Making sure your descriptions on YouTube have the topics that people are searching for.

Again, that I, said this at the beginning, I'll just repeat it now.

If I was starting a business all over again, I would do that exact same part of it, putting out video content on Facebook and reposting it to YouTube.

Because people aren't searching Facebook.

There is so much video content on Facebook, but people aren't searching Facebook the way that they're searching YouTube for how to information.

When you think about most organizing topics, they're almost always how to do something specific or what to do with that's a, that's a really good keyword what to do with blah, whatever it is.


We're talking about the beginning, what to do with old Christmas cards.

Do I keep them in a stack forever? Do I scrapbook them no.

<laugh> so, Jan see, oh yeah.

See, what other people are doing that is at least similar to what you're doing right now.

I know I was going to say that should be my next point.

Did I research a lot? What other people had created? I would say yes and no.

For example, I never took anybody else's organizing business course before I made my own organizing business course.

I didn't do that, but I, knew enough about what they offered to know what I felt was missing out there and to know that, I just really wanted to say something different.

To be honest with you I guys, I told you that I wanted to quit on this, idea before I even started multiple times.


And the thing that kept me going was every time I saw what I would say my competitors, although I really think that I made something that was substantially different.

But when I saw my competitors, I saw what was out there and I knew, in my heart, and I still feel this burning inside of me.

I knew in my heart how I felt when I wanted to start an organizing business.

When I researched online and saw what was out there.

Then so knowing how I felt when I started and then knowing what I knew after I had been doing it for a while, and I had some success doing some things that not else was doing.

I was, this ha this is missing.

This really needs to be said.

I think it really needs to be said in a way that is not threatening and intimidating to people.


So that, that's what kept me going is every time I saw what other people were selling and I was just, that is not, that's not what people really need.

I think that we all get stuck in perfectionism mode and this is those things are not helping.

That kept me going, you guys another thing, this is good advice.

This is take this, take this way, with a good heart, the way that, I mean, it, sometimes when you look out in the world, ie.

When you Google, maybe you want to Google the idea that you have and see if anybody else is doing it.

Sometimes the fact that somebody else is doing it means that it is a good idea.

Usually you can look at what it is that they're already doing and see a few ways to improve upon it.


And it doesn't mean that you are copying their idea.

It doesn't mean that you're copying their idea at all.

It just means that you are taking what you consider to be, because everything's relative.

You might consider it to be, oh, they did it, but it's mediocre or it doesn't look that great or it's not that easy to use or she doesn't really talk what the same way I do.

She doesn't have the same vibe I do.

It's, well, you could do the same topic, but you can do your own version.

That could be really successful for you.

The good thing is, whoever person a was proved that there was a market for it.

It's not copying.

It's just noticing, that something is making a little bit of money and doing something that is substantially better or more fitting for a very specific audience.


So on and so forth.

Sometimes when you look out there, I guess this is what some people say sometimes when you look out there and see that nobody has done what you've done, you get excited, but then people are, well, but does that mean it might not be a good idea? I don't know.

I, think it depends on what your topic is.

I think if you can find, if you can find articles or other advice or Pinterest boards that are related to the idea that you're thinking about, making a course about writing a book about, or doing a group program about, there is a market of people who want that help and are willing to pay for a little bit of personalized step by step help.

Rather than just going through life, trying to piece together, Pinterest articles and trying to figure it out on their own.

I believe that so strongly, oh, let me talk about this.

I have seen some organizers out there who, they don't just have one course.

They have a lot of courses.

In fact, they have a course about everything.


I'm not sure how I feel about that.

You know what I mean? Because it doesn't, it's, it might be nice because you're catching some of those people who are, oh, I don't want to pay for somebody to come to my home and help me do this.

Because remember that's your audience is your audience is mostly going to be people who they genuinely want help with something, but they're not quite willing to be a client of yours or anybody else's but they're, oh, but if it's specific to this topic, it can really show me what to do and I can work with the expert, then I will buy a course on it.

You're going to catch some of those type of people with a course about everything.

I've come across a few organizers I can think of who have done.

They've done a little course about kids and kitchens and meal planning and garages.


I mean, I don't know, they they've done a little bit of everything, photo organizing paper.

But that doesn't make this person stand out as an expert in any one thing.

I think that she or a few of these sheets, they might have been some of the first to create an organizing course of any kind.

It might have been the first of its kind and but it doesn't really, it's not they're catching all of that traffic.

That's searching for specific advice and specific really change.

That's I think that's the big word I'm looking for is, when you really want change in your life, aren't you so much more willing to invest a little bit of money in it? I feel I am so I must not be the only one.



Creating more.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't create more than one course, but it's so hard to do even one thing really well.

Especially if your one thing is your group program and you're going to pour a lot into this group program.

You're going to do a lot of content.

Again, you don't have to overwhelm people in order to be valuable, but just that you're going to give them the best of you.

When you're not organizing people in their house.

If you've decided to do that, you can't, you can't do three group programs that really well.

You could probably do one group program and you could create one course, but it's, just hard to do more than one thing.

Especially in more than one topic really well, because I think it starts to water down your energy and definitely water down your message because it's, are you the Christmas organizing expert or are you an expert on divorce and paperwork? 

I don't know.

That was my other random little niche.

Let's see what else I have in my notes here.

We've talked about the types of online products we've talked about.

Oh, we talked, when I was talking about <laugh> process for creating a product.

I know this is going to sound very simplistic, but you need to create an outline to end all outlines and think of every possible thing that needs to go in a place.

And maybe again, I know not all of us who are organized are organized in the same way, but this is definitely how my brain works.

Not I proved it to y'all in this chat today, but I do make lists.

When I when I think about talking about something really thoroughly, obviously it's going to be in your brain for a while.


Like if you're really going to do this, for example, this photo organizing course idea that I threw out there, it's, all right, start with, what are the big steps then go down and break each step down into what am I going to need to know to get this step done? And it's really, it sounds really easy.

It's not so easy, but anyway, make the big steps break down each step and then you have to decide on each step, what content that should be? Should it be a video? Should it be just text? It can just be text video.

Obviously it takes more time, but also gives your, I think you charge a little bit more for a course when you have video in it, not just not just writing and it doesn't have to be video of you talking this.


Like all of my videos and Inspired Organizer for example, are they're not of my face.

Because I know people are tired of it by that point.

<laugh> but it's me talking over slides with bullet points and then I do a lot of screen share tutorials.

When you go through each of your, big outline, you break down each one of the steps decide whether that step should be a video, a screen share.

Obviously if you're talking about digital photo organizing on my computer, you would be making a lot of screen share tutorials for me.

Because that will help me follow along.


I don't need to hear you talking about it.

You have to decide what type, if it's going to be a video, what type of video do what worksheets? 

It's good.

Its worksheets are good because it gives you again, something to give people it gives them a thing to work with even when you're not there with them.

They can print out a workbook or just some worksheets that go along with each lesson.

Again, your course does not have to be as, big and expansive as my course is it can be as short thing that still has one worksheet that goes with each module.

Little tip sheets to remember reminders or an even a create your own checklist template for whatever the niche is.

If you're talking about meal planning, obviously having some, blank printable calendars that have little things that are what's the word branded and cute that go with your little things that just give it that extra Ooo factor.


So I think you want to go through each little step of the big steps and decide what content does this need to be, then <laugh> then you have to go through and actually make all that content.

But do I have tips for this? I don't know.

I really can't tell you what I did to get all mine done except that I would batch together.

I would do everything of, one type all at once.

If I was going to make a lot of slides, I went ahead and made all the slides for the entire thing.

If I was going to do tutorial, screen share tutorials, I made a list with points.

I made a list of all the tutorials I needed to make with the points I needed to make in each one and the websites I needed to pull up for each one.


So I was, ready to go.

Basically just batch it as much as possible.

I didn't go through by module and say, I'm going to do a worksheet.

I'm going to do a video.

I'm going to do a screen share tutorial, and then I'm going to do whatever.

I, would do everything of one kind all at once.

If you're doing something photo organizing there might not be as much work there is not going to be as much workbook content.

It would be more a, maybe one master checklist that you're, all right, this will take them from day one to day three.

You could say you, if you devote three days, you could have all this done in three days.

Then you could say, of course you can spread it out over a longer period of time, but you tell them it's DIY, it's up to you.


You can do it at your own pace.

You have lifetime access to this course.

It's really a nice little sell because they, know if they buy it and they know <laugh>, if they ever get around to setting aside three days that they'll be able to knock it out.

It's just, it's, isn't it nice to know sometimes that, you've bought something, that's, it's there when I'm ready for it.

I'm just not quite ready for it yet.

That will happen.

You'll have people that'll buy stuff and they won't even do it right away or ever.

Can't be responsible, I guess, for everybody's results, but you want people to get results.

Asking for feedback, I think is important that if you do a group program, oh, here's a little tip <laugh> I feel I'm overwhelming you guys, a little tips, but little things keep coming up into my mind.


If you do a group program, and remember when I said, if I was going to recommend anything, I said, maybe start with this medium info product and do a, do a course.

I want to take my course.

I'm talking about, a short course photo organizing in a weekend, whatever that could be a DIY course or writing a book.

I was talking about creating that medium product first, because that might help you sell more in-home services at first.

I'm not sure exactly.

Again, I think the order's going to be different.

I think the order's going to be different for everybody, but if you do a group program and again, say you offer this group program say that you create this DIY course on something about Christmas organizing first, and then you go back and offer the group program just at a discount to say you had say you had 20 people who did your DIY course about Christmas organizing.


And it's did you enjoy this? I was thinking about doing a group program.

I would love for you to be one of my first members and give it to them at a discount.

You say I'm give you50% off of the year would cost a hundred dollars.

I don't know, making up price the year would cost a hundred dollars.

I just give you 50% off just to thank you for trying it out and just give me your feedback, whatever that could be a way that you get people started on it.

Here's a, here's a good tip when you get people going in the group program and you start actually - this is gold.

When you actually start interacting with people who are even a little bit invested and, you know enjoyed the course that you did.


And now they want to have, oh, that's really cool.

You're going to lay it out for 10 or 11 or 12 months for me.

That way I know that every month I'm going to spend a little bit of time on it's, oh, that's really cool.

Ashley said the yoga program she bought, but she hasn't done yet.

She said, she'll do it soon.

Once you actually start getting feedback from people they're in the group program, this is so good.

This is so good.

Once you start getting feedback from these people, you can use that feedback to create some of this other beginner stuff up at the top.

For example, once you get, once you get people in the group program and you hear some, you'll start getting feedback from people, you hear some of those same few things over and over and over again.


It's, oh, this is so good.

I always just get stuck on this one thing or these two or three things, or it's always the family members.

I have no idea what people talk about.

Go back and say, oh, what is the thing that people need most in order to maybe it's not the thing that you thought, right? Maybe that when I talk about gated free information, another term that people use online in online business is a lead magnet.

A lead magnet would be that free ebook.

That's about the exact topic that people are struggling with in this, in your group program.

Because that way that people have this pro you when they see that free ebook, they're, oh my gosh, I, have to have that.

I have no idea.

I had to tell my mom not to give me any more Christmas presents, they will tell you everything you need to know.


And then you can even use that to make your cheap information product, right? Everything that they're struggling with in this group program, you can make, those, freebie worksheets or the freebie mini-course about some certain topic.

God, what I keep saying free, it's a cheap mini course or a cheap membership area.

The, these little cheap information products I was talking about, you can use the information that they tell you straight out of their mouth in your group program.

Right there, you basically have filled in that whole funnel that I just talked about by utilizing the actual feedback from the people who have the exact problems that you want to help them with.

Essentially you don't have to do all of the thinking and planning and figuring it out in terms of making people happy.

You got to be super committed and listen to what they say and listen to their feedback.


But even, once you even once you create a course, you can go back and revise it and update it and add in an extra bonus module.

People be, oh my gosh, thank you so much.

It's, oh, well, it's actually just questions that you guys had that I forgot to put in there the first time.

You make it look you.

Not just make it look, you just become the answer to the problems that people are searching for online.

Remember I said, the end goal is to have a lot of people who trust you.

I think, again, we talked about factors in building trust.

One is being a member of the audience that you're trying to serve.

Another one is just taking, their requests and their questions and their feedback to heart and showing that you're trying to, create some resource just to make life a little bit easier for them on that topic.


So I think, oh, that was a really, that was such a good little trick.

So, that was my process for creating the product.

I know it sounds easier than it really is, but the thing is, you can make it as hard as you want it to be.

It's not, I said, people want a transformation.

They don't need to be, they don't need to be a hundred percent sure that you are a scholar on every aspect of the topic.

You really just need to give them the information that is going to make the most impact in their life and then move on to the next, the next piece of it and the next module.

You can always give people, especially if you're doing a group program, you can always give people extra support and extra, reassurance or whatever on the certain things that maybe you didn't go into as much depth in your course or, and I keep acting you guys are combining all these together.


Maybe you're not combining them all together, but you're just using what people are asking for and filling in another part of your, part of your funnel with the products.

Then when people are, oh, I loved maybe they say, I love your course, but I really want to know more about how to make photo books.

You're, oh, well, that's not really part of the original thing, but if that's something that enough people ask for, they're basically telling you, I will pay you money to give me tutorials and how to create photo books.

Does it matter that they can go get that on YouTube for free? No, they asked you because they trust you now.

They like your style.

They like how you teach.

They trust your judgment and everything.


So you can, let your audience guide you a little bit.

First and foremost though, you got to be willing to put yourself out there to have an audience.

I know that was that going back to fears that I had about starting this that was definitely a huge one.

I had never, I didn't even have social media really when I had my organizing business, because I was all insecure about what I post on Instagram and that.

Then all of a sudden it was, oh, I'm really thinking I want to <laugh> have talk to people on Facebook and YouTube.

Again, I didn't know I had the love for it that I did.

I definitely learned a lot about myself, but I was willing to put myself out there because I said, I wanted, I wanted to, I, guess, I just, I really wanted to be what I wish that I would've had when I started my business.


So I wanted to be that person for somebody else.

That was, if I can just be that person for one other person, that it will all be worth it to me.

We talked about process for creating the product.

We talked about a little bit about marketing the product.

I'm not going to be able to go super in detail about, you know your writing when it comes to selling your product and marketing your product.

A lot of what you're going to be doing, even though your audience might have gotten to know you through video.

A lot of what you need to do is write well in order to sell and in order for people to trust you.

But also to give the right tone and vibe about what to expect from you.

You want Hunter says, Hey, you want, I mean, when you're, when you're when you're writing a sales page for something and if you guys are, again, think big, if you guys are serious about your, online business dreams you will, at some point be, I've really got to study, or I've really got to learn something about it's called copywriting.


That that's just the act of writing words on a page, on the internet and in order to sell something.

It's not all about talking about why you're so qualified and what all of the benefits of, sorry, not what all of your group program, for example includes it's why does that matter to them always be thinking about, talking about why it matters to them and what the benefit is for them, what the transformation is for them.

Again, when it comes to selling, I don't think of selling so much as being, okay.

By my thing, now, I think of it more what's the cost of you not doing this, for example, if somebody's going to sell me right now on this photo organizing course, do it yourself, digital photo organizing.

They put up a sales page that was just so it's got 28 videos and I am a master photo organizer.


I would be interested again, because I did tell you I need this, but I wouldn't be as interested as the person who came along and said, this, will help you finally cross this project off your list.

It has been on it forever that you keep pushing back and, well do you really want to get to your daughter's 10th birthday and you haven't even made a, baby book because all your photos are all over the place.

If you wrote that on a sales page, I would start crying and then I would press by now for $250.

You see what I'm saying? You need to connect with people's emotions.

Don't just describe well, it's, a course and I don't know, y'all, get it.

It doesn't need to be too focused on you who made it, needs to be very focused on the person who is for, because when people buy things, they're thinking about themselves, they're thinking about what they want out of it though.


So that's a very brief description of how to sell products is you need to connect with people's emotions and a little bit of fear of what will happen if they don't do it.

Not that I'm saying, you need to oversell on, if you they do always say, you have to introduce some urgency into what you're selling.

It shouldn't be available probably all the time because people don't buy things that are available all the time, because they'll say, oh, I'll just get to it later.

I'm willing to bet Ashley.

She was just talking about her yoga course that she bought and she hasn't done yet.

I'm willing to bet she bought it because it wasn't going to be available at the same price, or maybe just available at all the time.

Ashley, tell me if I'm right or not.


Tell me if there was some urgency involved.

Obviously with the group program, let's talk about this.

Your group program should probably, if you're doing, whether it's six weeks or a year, you should probably be starting it only at certain times, obviously, so that you can go through it together with one group at a time.

That group can get to know each other, et cetera, et cetera.

So, if you're doing a yearlong group program, it's, you've got to really be thinking ahead of when does this need to be marketed when do I need to sell this? Because if it's starting in February, for example, I can't wait till the middle of January and go, oh yeah.

I need to get some people on my email list.

You need to be building that email list in advance.


This does take some advanced planning, but it's not it's impossible.

It's okay to start small, your first group program.

I was saying, I could have five people in it.

You could just, and you could just say, I just want to give you guys an extreme discount on this and be my testers and help me figure out how to improve this.

Then next time can be next time it can, oh, okay.

Ashley said she had a feeling the price would go up and it did.


Those are triggers that help people take action.

It is beneficial for a lot of reasons.

One is because the people who are just on the fence, on the fence on the fence are you get off the fence, and buy it.


Or you might, maybe I'm just not right for you.

That's, fine.

You can go ahead and help people move along to wherever it is they need to go.

But also it's a lot easier for you because you're not constantly trying to sell something.

So, if you have, for example, if, you have a let's go back to some of these things, some of your free things, or some of your cheap things obviously will probably be available all the time, because those are those aren't so much about the money, right?

Even the cheap product, the cheap product, isn't so much about the seven or $9 that they're paying for it.

It's more about helping pull them further into your web of awesomeness that you have created, with all this stuff.

So, you want those to be available all the time, and then, maybe even your book that you're selling, your real book that you're selling again, I know that takes time, but that's probably available all the time too.


Amazon is kind, I didn't mention this.

Amazon is another one of the search engines, remember I said, Pinterest is used as a search engine.

YouTube is, Amazon is for certain types of things, They're not going to type in there what to do with Christmas cards, but they're going to be how to have a minimalist, or minimalism Christmas, minimalist holidays.

That would be a good search phrase that people would look for on, Amazon.

Because it's, I bet you there is a book about this and I need to give my mother-in-law.

I don't know.

<laugh> So, that's a place that is another good, evergreen source of, they're not just buying your book, they're getting to know you, they're probably going to visit your website if they've bought your book.

If you miss this at the beginning, we said, not only can it be, it can be a self-published book or it can just be an ebook.


And I have actually experimented with that.

I think I missed this point at the beginning.

I experimented with, I created my own ebook and put it on Amazon as a lead magnet for Pro Organizer Studio.

It didn't cost that much, but it was something again that I was trying to put myself in the way of people who are searching for a specific topic.

I ended up taking, I ended up taking it down because every time I updated, I had to keep updating it.

I didn't I felt I was updating it too many places and I was trying to minimize my, business life.

I took that off.

But the point is it's very easy.

You, if you go and search for publish your own kind book, I can't remember what Amazon calls it, but it's self-publishing for Kindle.


This is very easy.

You don't even have to, it doesn't.

I know this sounds awful, but it doesn't have to be the greatest thing ever.

It's just, it's got to be informational a little entertaining a little bit.

Well written, obviously, if you're not good at editing, you need to have somebody edit it and make sure that you're not putting something out there with just tons of mistakes, but I'm sure you guys have bought a book on Kindle.

Put I download books on Kindle on my phone all the time.

Some of them are, I mean, the information is good, but it's not they're perfectly written.

There are a lot of mistakes and stuff, so let it be not perfect.

Not ideal.

Get it out there.

You can always update it again later.

What was I talking about though?


Oh, so I was talking about things that are available all the time, your Amazon book, and then all this other stuff above, it could be available all the time.

But say this DIY course on photo organizing that Brie's going to make.

Let's say that says that that's only available four or five times a year.

Brie sends, so I'm on Brie's email list because Brie, because I found Brie and I was Googling something about photo organizing because I was for the love of God for the last time, how do I get things from my iPhone to my computer, and be sure that I didn't accidentally delete something out of iCloud or whatever.

I found her blog post and she had a free ebook that was the first couple of steps.

I downloaded it.


So now I'm on her email list because I'm, God, this girl's a genius.

Then because I'm on her email list and the next couple of times she's, oh, by the way, I have this photo organizing course.

Here's what it includes and it's available for the next enrollment period coming up soon.

Then it'll be, it won't be open again until later during the year.

She doesn't have to be specific with me.

She's just saying, by the way, this is only open a few times a year.

It's really doable for the price.

Here are some of the testimonials, blah, blah, blah.

I'm, oh my gosh.

Absolutely. Yes.

I go ahead and buy it because I don't want to wait three or four more months for it to come available again.

You know? So that's a little bit about how to get $250 from me in case you're wondering!


So your, so your bigger programs, so your course and your group program will not, it will serve you better for them to not be open all the time.

Obviously with the group program, it's better, especially if you're moving through a structured amount of material for, especially for a short amount of time that new people can't just come in and out or whatever, they need to pay probably for the year and then it's, you have access to it and you're in it and we're all going to go through this together.

Then something the Christmas thing, Christmas comes around every year.

Do you want to do this? You want, do you want to be a repeat? Do you want to be a, what's the word, do you want to, what's the word when - you don't graduate, but you do it again and you're - I don't know what I'm saying, but maybe you give a discount and say, do you want to do this?


You want to do this course again with us next year, you could be a mentor almost or whatever.

I don't know what I'm saying.

You can have people pay to do it again because it's a yearly topic.

Maybe that will work for some of you guys.

Maybe it won't.


I just have a few other points that I'm going to make.

Then I'm going to close this up because I know it's getting real long unless you guys have other questions.

I will tell you a few reasons why I think that and <laugh> please take this for what I mean, I want you guys to succeed, with this.

I know that I have had some really big ups and downs with having an online business.

In one aspect is definitely a dream of mine come true.


And another aspect, it is harder than I ever thought something would be.

Maybe because I feel so responsible.

I'm somebody who feels extra responsible for people even when it's not my business I want everybody to do well.

So, but one reason why I think that I have been able to have a level of success with this and this is what I want you guys to take and apply to your own endeavors and maybe compared to some other people not, just, not in the organizing world, but just in general, other people that have online courses and other people whose courses I have taken that have left a bad taste in my mouth.

That's what I'm trying to say, is that I've done a lot better, especially this year in general at not being tied to my phone and tied to my Facebook group and tied to the online business, which means that you can do everything from your phone and when you're on your phone all the time your kids will notice, your spouse will notice.


And obviously if you're working on the job, they might eventually notice - all three of those things have happened to me.

I get it.

I think that you have to be, you have to be good at turning it off, but at the same time, really giving some undivided attention to the people, especially who have paid and invested with you, but even the ones who haven't really giving them your attention.

But on a regular basis and all I'm trying to say here is I have noticed very much in other groups and other courses where the creator of the course is not actually present in the group.

It's all automated posting, on Facebook.

I don't like that even when they offer other support things, it's either be in the group or don't, I don't automate it and make it seem you're posting every week when it's the same thing over and over again.


I don't like that.

I, there are some strategies out there, I guess that say that you can do that.

I just don't think that that's a good way to go.

I think that I have been successful to, again, I said, I'm not making a million dollars a month, but I'm, just saying, I think I've been successful in this because I'm very personal with my audience.

I know people and I remember people and when people send me emails, I remember that forever.

Just things like that.

I make a point to do those things because I know how much it has impacted me when I have written an email to thank somebody for some content that they put out there.

And I don't do that very often.

It has to be a really big deal.


I've written to people and then just not even gotten a response back and I'm just, man, <laugh>, if they don't like that email, if they don't reply to that email, what do they reply to? Because I know how overwhelming it is to have a full inbox and for it to be mostly annoying stuff.

If you can't reply to somebody who genuinely is, oh my God, you changed my life with something that you did on the internet then why are you even doing it? You know? So that's why I just, I never want to lose that connection with people.

That's one reason why, again, I said, I'm not willing for there to be no end to my funnel of selling.

It's more I know where I can help people.


I know where I can do my best work.

My biggest impact Brie said she was squealing, which when I wrote back to her okay, the next thing is, the next thing I write down was I have I've showed up consistently in my business in some way every day.

That doesn't mean, I always, for example, I was talking about making a point to set aside time to whether you have a free Facebook group.

I'm talking about across the board with everything we're talking about here, whether you have a blog and people comment on it, or whether you have a free Facebook group or whether you have your YouTube channel and you get comments there, I just really think it's important to engage with people.

it doesn't mean that you have to reply to every single thing right away, but just that you do read things and engage with people consistently.


In with my specific business, with my specific course, which is a big, a big thing and a bigger investment and, but people get it forever.

It's not just a limited time.

I will take social media breaks, but I always come back and get on my computer and read everything and reply to everything.

I know <laugh> in general, there are no emergencies, but I just try to always, I never want anybody to think that I miss their notification or their comment that they mention me in.

Anyway, so I guess what I'm trying to say is having, I have learned that having boundaries with all this is super important and making sure that people are, it's, I will reply to my email, but I can't do the Instagram private messages and Facebook, private messages, just email me.


I believe that you'll get my reply best there, or I can reply best to you there.

Having boundaries is important, but also just giving and being, you know generous with your, with your people is really important too.

Because I just know when people don't do that, it just hurts right here.

Not because I paid for their stuff, but just because it's, oh I genuinely just wanted to reach out and tell you how awesome that was and then just don't even reply back.

Then I wrote down when it comes to skills, I would say I do, I do have some tech skills, but the more, the more important thing is that I'm willing to Google and learn anything that I don't know.

I am willing to pour through the boring FAQ and helps sections of all these apps that I talk about.


Teachable, Convert Kit, your email service provider, MailChimp.

They have so much free information to help you out there and, go there first to be honest.

There are always YouTube videos that people will make, they'll show you tutorials about how to do stuff.

But for example, Convert Kit, which I use for a long time for my email it's in their best interest to show you everything there is to know about not only using their product, but using it to grow your business and get more people to sign up for your emails and how to do cool sign up forms that don't look dinky.

They want you to look great and they want you to succeed.

All that stuff is there.

When I, when I say I do have, I have a definitely have a level of comfort with all things computer, however, when it came to something that I didn't know, I mean I sat and taught myself and I've taught myself a lot of graphic, design stuff on my own.


Again, some of these were skills I already had, but there are, there are resources you got to use your resources for, everything.

I definitely think there is a paid version of everything and a free version of almost everything.

Usually paying something is better than paying nothing - but paying a lot is usually not necessary.

That's definitely my feeling about that when it comes to this stuff.

Then very last one, not least a reason that I think I have been successful is because I did not wait to, how would I say this? Some, people would say, for example, oh, well you should you should work with people.

You should you should do private coaching online first and then figure out what people want in a course.

Then, make the course.

No, I didn't even, I didn't even ask anybody what they thought about it before I did it.


I knew for sure that I wanted to say what I needed to say and that it was different than what other people had done and I put it out there and then I took the feedback that I got from that, so to heart, spent, I mean, not, I'm saying I obsessed over it, but I'm just saying, I took all the questions I got.

I took all the feedback I got, it was documented.

I have people who helped me document it and organize it.

They know who they are before I revamped and updated the course as Inspired Organizers.

Everything's categorized and documented and I use that to improve it.

I think continuous improvement is really important, more important than saying well you need to wait until you're more of a co one-on-one coaching expert online.


I don't think that's necessarily true.

Another helpful piece of advice, and this came from somebody I want to share with you Mariah, her name is Mariah because and she is the person at a website called Femtrepreneur.

Femtrepreneur is her and Megan Minns, who I think is her assistant sidekick.

They say experts don't create courses; courses create experts.

What they meant by that.

I told myself that a lot when I was creating my thing at first, because again, nobody knew who I was.

Nobody knew I was doing.

I didn't ask for anybody's feedback before I did it.

I was just, I think I'm going to put this out there.

I don't know.

I can't really tell you what I was thinking now, except just that I had to, I felt I had to.

But I remember thinking to myself, not necessarily that I was trying to become an expert, but that I was just, well, of course, nobody knows an expert before they write their book or before they make their course.


But once you do that, people will see you as an expert.

If any, one of you guys wrote a book on something right now, I would drop on the floor and be, oh my gosh, you are you are an expert.

I had no idea.

You're so amazing.

I would tell everybody that I know you because you're published on Amazon.

Nobody knows that you just did it yourself.

<laugh> so I'm not saying I see through it now, but I'm just saying, I see how it works, how it works is you organize your ideas and you organize your content and you put it into something helpful and you put it out there and then people look at you and say, oh my gosh, you have a perspective and you have answers that I don't have.

people will definitely, I mean, I'm trying to break this down and make it seem it's not a big deal because I want you guys to do something with it, but people will think you're a big deal.


And I think you should just let them think that because it does feel pretty good.

because it takes some confidence, I think, to continue to put yourself out there, especially when you are opening yourself up to criticism.

you need to have the people who said all the great things about you, so that you can take the criticism and work with it and continue to grow.

That's definitely something I've learned too, I expected, I expected to have haters and I know that I do.

Luckily most of them are not too vocal, but it does happen.

I'm so glad that I took that risk because it's so much less than I imagined it would be.

I imagined I was going to have NAPO beating down my door and arresting me.

Really <laugh> okay.

Margaret said she paid for two other organizing courses and got much of nothing out of them got most, mostly nothing out of them.


So guys, I think that I have I think I've covered all my topics.

I hope that this was enlightening.

It was definitely cathartic for me because a lot of this is stuff that I had wanted to bring up, but I didn't know how to approach it.

I was happy to share it with you guys here.

If you guys still have more questions after this, please leave it in the comments.

Because I'm sure I have more to say about any one thing.

If you ask me about it.

Because I've got lots of experience now and I know a lot of smart people because I've met them through this job and in fact, so if I can't help you, I know that I know people who can and also, so I promised you guys some good resources that I do really...


I did really learn a lot from, because I didn't just think all this stuff up on my own.

Femtrepreneur that's the one that I just mentioned it's Mariah and Megan Minns and I really both of them a lot.

They teach, they have a course about creating a course.

I did not take it.

I have taken a couple of the, I've taken a couple of Megan's small courses.

They're both, they're both good, but they have tons and I mean, tons of, free information on their website and blog and their, they have a YouTube channel that doubled as their podcast.

They, they videoed themselves while they were creating a podcast and then put it on YouTube.

I've listened to every, I did at that time, listened to every single one of those.


Brie said, she's going to go back and listen to this from the beginning.

I cannot fathom that.

<laugh> so, Femtrepreneur really good.

It's about, it's about creating courses and it's about creating other online products, but their main thing is about getting your idea, getting the confidence to move forward with your idea and about not making it so overwhelming.

They also teach a lot about the back end, technical stuff of Teachable and Convert Kit.

Some of those, some of those resources that I went with from the beginning, I mean, they recommended because they were good for beginners.

Again, I, said, I feel I grew past that, but they, I definitely owe them again.

I didn't work with them one-on-one, or even take their big course, but I owe a lot of what I have been able to do to what I learned from them.



Who else? I mentioned Melyssa Griffin.

I learned, I did take her Pinterest class called Pinfinite Growth.

It was really good.

I know that some things have changed with Pinterest recently and she just put out an update to her course.

I have to go take the whole thing again.

I've mentioned this as a resource before, probably in the Inspired Organizer group, but board booster, which is a tool for Pinterest that Melyssa teaches you how to use, just shut down.

I got to figure out what she's recommending now.

But definitely my Pinterest game grew because of her.

It made me feel good.

That's how a lot of people found me.

Eventually when I had my free, I had my free Facebook group my questions to enter the group were just Hey, how'd you find how'd you find us?


And so people would always say Pinterest or YouTube.

I mean it sometimes Google.

Then at near the end, they would say oh, Carrie, say, can I put links to these? Yes, I will.

I'll edit the description after I'm done.

Facebook eventually, I said, at the end, once your Facebook at the end of when I had my group open the free one, they would sometimes say they just found it because Facebook suggested it, which that was really cool.

Again, that was a good pro.

Other, resources, I mentioned one another big one for me for learning about everything about Facebook ads, which we didn't talk about in, this, we did not talk about it, this in this chat, but if you took my if you took the, if you're an Inspired Organizer, I do talk about, I teach about Facebook ads and I talk about in general about if you had a product, here's how it would work out in your financial spreadsheet and blah.


You can project it, which is really cool.

It's probably one of my favorite parts.

I talk about Facebook ads in the Inspired Organizer course, I also did a special workshop on a really specific Facebook ad campaign for professional organizers to use.

That was called Campaign by Numbers.

I did that back in May.

I might do it again or I might open it again.

I'm not sure there are a lot of things changing with Facebook ads right now, too, because of privacy and all the stuff that happened with data hacking and invasion and that thing selling it to other parties anyway.

I'm not sure, if I'm going to open that again, but if you're interested, will you let me know, because I don't know if people want to do that or if they don't it was $75.


So it was just a quick workshop, there were four lessons, here's how to set up a specific ad campaign to your target audience.

This was for in-person services in your area.

However, if you were so, you got Inspired Organizer to talk about Facebook ads, I've got the, that workshop, which was, again, it was very specific, but you learned a lot of things that you could use in different situations.

If you were to take everything that I talked about today and combine it with what you learned in that workshop or combine it with what from Inspired Organizer, you would have enough information to say, oh, if I were to create a course and it was about photo organizing or it was about <laugh>, I'm not sure about the Christmas one, but anyway, if it was about photo organizing, then I would know how to find my audience on Facebook.


Then I know is interested in this thing and create a targeted ad campaign to them.

That is the way, and I'm, I feel I'm leaving you hanging with this, but this is true.

That is the way that if you want to reach people that are not just searching for you, if you - we just talked about Pinterest, Google, Facebook, letting the people come to you.

If you want to reach people that are in your target audience that are probably interested in this topic and, reach them on Facebook, through Facebook advertising.

If you guys listen to any Gary Vaynerchuk preaching, <laugh>, he's an online business guy.

He's not a preacher, but he does a lot of soul, searching preaching.

If you listen to anything he talks about it's, Facebook ads are the most underrated or undervalued way that you can advertise online or advertise at all to anyone anywhere today.


That's the way that you can reach people.

You want to reach exactly.

The people that you want and not spend tens of thousands of dollars, paying for radio and print and advertising in the traditional way TV.

I'm a believer in that for sure.

That's definitely, I have talked to you guys, you probably know that's how I got my organizing business.

Just the in person services off the ground is through a few Facebook ads.

This is again, years ago before they are what they are now.

There is so much more ability capability now.

The person who I do recommend, if you want to get more deep into that, to have a level of knowledge, that you can do all of that on your own.

Her name is Courtney Foster Donahue, and she teaches a course called Facebook Everything.


And I have taken it because I wanted to be as knowledgeable as possible about everything, about Facebook, everything.

I definitely recommend that, is very good.

As I said, at the beginning of this, I don't want you to feel you also have to invest thousands of dollars in your own business development.

I have in order to learn all this stuff, I think you could learn, I feel experience is still the best teacher, trying something, getting some feedback, reevaluating, improving, and then putting it back out there.

<laugh> So it's just the strength of continuing to put yourself back out there.

That is the real deal.

Well, just a parting note.

I know some people will be listening to this on the replay and, or on YouTube and maybe still clueless about who I am.


That's okay with me, but I am available in my now we talked about courses in groups for so long.

Now my course slash group is Inspired Organizer.

It is not an ongoing monthly fee.

It's just a one time fee.

The course is all about the business side of organizing.

It is not about how to organize other people.

It is not about how to set up the business part per se, business licensing.

I trust you've gotten to that point, but it's about how to market and sell and brand yourself and how to sell package packages large packages.

You should not be walking out of a house with only $25 per hour that you were there.

I teach you how to sell four figure packages get paid up front, be working the project with awesome people who are really committed to what you're doing.


Like it's a whole different game changer.

Not saying every client's a dream, but they're pretty awesome.

It's all about people who are willing to pay high for a higher-end experience.

How to create that experience, how to brand yourself so that people, you know trust you, that you deliver on that.

Allison, thank you.

She says I've changed her business.

Then of course, how to manage those projects and how to market yourself in the many, ways there are to market a business these days.

What we do in the course is we I take you through creating a business system.

I basically help you create that funnel that we talked about in this chat, which for our purposes is mainly the top part.


And then the bottom part and that's why you can skip just straight to the bottom and do the one-on-one and do the high end one-on-one service, which is, should be, can be, and should be the most expensive thing that you sell.

But through this chat today, hopefully figured out a few other things you can put along the way.

In the course that help you build that system so that you can sell the one-on-one services.

Then the last module is how to market and get more people into the top so that they can trickle down.

Which is the awesome part.

By the time you're there, you're ready to go, turn the heat up on fire.

I feel I've wanted more people to ask about Facebook ads.


I wanted more people to ask about online products because that's, where I feel my, my passion comes out and obviously, because I can talk about it for three hours, but where some of my strategy stuff shines.

But I know that maybe some people just need a little bit more information to get going.

That was why I wanted to bring this up today.

Allison says, you can't say enough about this program, Jen and the tribe.

I'm so happy that we have you Allison and I'm so glad the rest of you guys were here.

Anything else you can email us and we'll talk with y'all soon.

Thank you.

Thank you.


You know you have a Powerful Presence, but still don't know how to truly translate your work online without losing precious energy, time, and money.

Find out the 2 types of leaders I can help, my 10 Signs Of Success, and the 6 steps I use to get you there. Plus, see a case study and learn more about my vivid vision for what we can accomplish together →